Read the Transcript:

Naomi Nakamura: Hello there, my friends Welcome back to The Live FAB Life Podcast. I’m your host Naomi Nakamura.

Today we’re in for a treat, because I’m joined by returning guest, Nadia Gabrielle. Nadia previously joined me in Episode 179 on Subconscious Capacity Building, Episode 201, On Exploring a Self-Projected Authority, and in Episode 217, where we did a Projectors Rapid Fire Q&A.

If you’re not familiar with Nadia and her work, she’s the founder and creator of the Instagram account @ProjectorsInvited. If you’re a Projector, it’s a must follow.

Nadia also helps clients with designing business strategy and up leveling subconscious capacity. She uses her professional background to fill the much-needed gap between business strategy, design and technology with well-being and personal development. She’s the creator of Service Design School, and several different workshops and classes and, she also works with clients one-on-one.

Today, you’ll hear us expand more on capacity and why capacity is critical for success in business work, and life. You'll hear us talk about the importance of strategy and business design, and how to bring it all together in a way that is supportive of each of our unique Human Designs.

Nadia also announced her a brand-new offering that's coming soon, and she shares a special time-sensitive offer to work with her exclusively to uplevel your subconscious capacity.

I’m so fortunate to be a student and a client of Nadia, and I'm so grateful to be able to call her my friend. So, with that, let's get to the show.

Hello there, my friend, welcome back to the show.

Nadia Gabrielle: Hello and thank you for having me.

Naomi Nakamura: I think this is your fourth appearance here on the podcast.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yay. Yes, it is a pleasure to be here.

Naomi Nakamura: Well, you know, you always have an open door to join me whenever you are feeling up to it.

Nadia Gabrielle: That is my favorite thing. Thank you. I really, really appreciate it.

Naomi Nakamura: So, we've had you on talking about capacity. In the past, we've talked about being a Self-Projected Projector.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yes.

Naomi Nakamura: We did a Project Q&A, which has proven to be one of the most popular episodes, which is really interesting, and today we’re talking about amplifying our successes.

So, before we get into that, what have you been up to since the last time you were here?

Nadia Gabrielle: Remind me when was the last year was it the Projector Rapid Fire episode?

Naomi Nakamura: It was early it was last year. I think that was probably about thirty episodes ago.

Nadia Gabrielle: Okay, so mid last year, something like that. I mean, it doesn't matter because I've just been having fun. 2022 was my fun and fulfilling year; I've just been having a good time. It's definitely been my best year yet in my adult life.

I've done a lot of capacity work in the years leading up and of course have been in business for myself for a couple years now. And last year I hit that really sweet spot where my strategy was on point and my business was just flowing and going really great. My capacity is on point thanks to all that work prior and it just seemed like a really opportune moment to sort of shift gears and really focus on fulfilment in my personal life.

So, I still worked with clients and taught some, I worked a lot less last year because again, that's how I set up my business to allow me to do that. That has always been the plan for me from day one and we'll talk more about that later on in the episode. I've just been having a good time.

Naomi Nakamura: Following your Instagram stories it looks like it's been a fabulous time! Every little bit of your day that you share I enjoy!

Nadia Gabrielle: Thank you! I always think, “this a bit monotonous in terms of context” because I just go for my walk and then I read, and I cook basically do all the same things but I really thoroughly enjoy my little routine

Naomi Nakamura: But you do it with a little bit of luck because you do a lot of baking to isolate the things that you bake and that is fancy because my baking comes from a box.

Nadia Gabrielle: Really?

Naomi Nakamura: It does. Oh, I'm not a baker but what I feel inclined, it comes from a box.

Nadia Gabrielle: Well, there are good boxes, there are good box mixes and stuff I hear; we don't have that here so much. I mean we do have them but not to the extent that you would, but you know I love to be in the kitchen, I love to make a mess.

Naomi Nakamura: So, what’s your secret to have freedom to create this wonderful business, to be able to enjoy life this way? Because those of us who are entrepreneurs, who have side hustles - it feels like we're working all the time.

Nadia Gabrielle: Absolutely. It's a really good question. I think, well, spoiler alert, right? It's gonna be Strategy and Capacity. What a joy to have a business and a strategic service, and a product setup that just works and allows you to live life.

On the capacity side, I always tell my clients as well, we're not just meeting every two weeks, every three weeks, whatever their interval is, just for fun, or because it's nice. The objective here really, for all inner work, self-development work is to get to enjoy our more developed selves, right, to live more joyfully.

I think sometimes that can get lost in the sheer enormity of the laundry list of self-help and all the things we need to do to be okay.

Naomi Nakamura: A year ago, it was the new year and I planned to do some shadow work. I think it lasted a week. I was like, “I feel too depressed all the time.” I thought is this good?

Nadia Gabrielle: And then what did you do?

Naomi Nakamura: I stopped doing it.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah, I mean, I don't know if shadow work is supposed to feel good. I think you're right, on good intentions, but then when then you're like…

Naomi Nakamura: Well, I want to spend my time doing other things. Can I do this in other ways?

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah. And you know, I think sometimes when the need is there - there's this friend of mine shared this with me a few years back – it’s maybe a Kundalini thing where they say that if time is on you start and the pressure will be off.

I just always think of that when the moment comes for one specific endeavor, you’ll feel it. And then when you start, you’ll feel like you're on the right track. And then there are also certain things where you're like, “Yeah, maybe not right now.” Or maybe, “I don't need this at this time.”

Naomi Nakamura: So, for those who maybe haven't listened to our capacity episode yet, can we have a quick refresher on what that is?

Nadia Gabrielle: Absolutely. Let me just preface this by saying in my paradigm of business, we have two main pillars - strategy and capacity.

So, we just do strategy we kind of all know, right? It's what you learned in business school, if that's where you went. It's the formula, the blueprint, the objectives, the business plans, the launch plan, the marketing, the sales strategy, all of that.

It's all of the things that you can learn using your conscious minds, which most of us love to do, including me, meaning you can gather this knowledge on an intellectual level. You can read it a book, you can study it, you can take a course and then apply it on that same level.

However, you'll soon find probably having been in business for yourself for a while, will have already found that even these, let's say more impersonal concepts can become real personal, real quick when it comes to their application.

And this is where that second pillar comes in, which is capacity. Let's say if you've just taken a course on business strategy, and you've learned some really valuable things and now you're able to craft a plan for yourself on how you wish to advance in your own business using these strategies, applying them more often than not.

Before long, you’ll hit some sort of barrier, because even though we know exactly what we need to do on the strategy level, because we've learned it, we find ourselves not doing it. This is what I hear from clients often.

Naomi Nakamura: Isn't that what we were just talking about?

So, for listeners, I actually had a strategy session with Nadia last spring. I have my whole strategy laid out. Well, I've been working on it a little, but I didn't genuinely start putting effort into it until recently. And a lot of it does have to do with capacity, as I was telling you., I'm creating this thing and I'm like, “Is anyone going to be interested in this? Is anyone going to want this?”

And there's also the enormity of the thing. As we've discussed before we started recording, it’s hard - people underestimate how hard it is as a solopreneur.

Nadia Gabrielle: As someone you know, who works for themselves, who doesn't have a whole cheer squad, or a team, you set your own deadline, and you can postpone your deadline indefinitely. There’s no dependency there.

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly.

Nadia Gabrielle: And so, it takes a lot of drive, and it takes a lot of self-starting. And that’s part of what I call a “capacity ceiling” because capacity, and again, you know me, we've done an entire episode on this - I looked up, it was Episode 179?

Naomi Nakamura: I think so.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah. So, I really recommend people listen to Episode 179 if this is an entirely new concept to you.

But in a nutshell, capacity is the container. It's your vessel. It's what you can hold. It's what you can sustain. It's your ability to say no. It's your ability to speak up, to dare to even center yourself or your business in your offers in a conversation, your ability to set boundaries, your level of comfort with being seen, especially for your business owner. This will be important for you, your “okay-ness” with charging, with getting paid for your products or services, your sense of sovereignty over yourself and your business, your ability to make your own decisions. All of these are little capacity platforms that you have, and they're not all going to be on the same level and I can tell you from my own experience, and from years and years of working with clients on these topics, when the strategy and the capacity are not aligned, it's so hard to make any sort of progress.

Naomi Nakamura: I think it's really not to easy say, but it's really simple for us to talk about these things. But when you're actually in it, you're actually in the moment, you're like, “Oh my goodness!”

I've always said that the biggest exercise in personal growth and self-development is starting a business.

Nadia Gabrielle: It really is. It brings you face-to-face with everything so quick, and you can't walk away from it. I mean, you can but then what's the alternative?

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly. I think the most simplest thing that a lot of our listeners can relate to is using social media as a regular person versus using it as a solopreneur. It's a whole different body and I speak deeply from personal experience.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, same. I mean, I'm not naturally very outward. So, sharing was, especially in the beginning, incredibly difficult for me. There was a very low-capacity ceiling that I hit couple days in and I had to grapple with that because in the end, as a business owner, as a Projector, in particular, right, talk about waiting for the invitation that's going to require for you to be visible enough that people can actually know what you're doing, what you're up to, know what you're available for. You can't hide yourself away.

So, even if you've got the best strategy, you took a really good course, you have a solid blueprint to work with, if there’s any part of your system that’s terrified of you applying that and resulting in success, then guess what, you're not going to do it.

And if there’s any part of your system that’s for some reason, convinced that it's not safe for you to be visible, less to be criticized or, or canceled or what have you - again, you will not apply this amazing strategy. If there is any part of your system that believes that if you up your revenue bad things will happen, you'll no longer be relatable, or you're no longer part of your identity group because you're no longer upholding some collective unspoken agreement, and this really often happens with artists, I find, again, that belief is going to dictate your capacity.

It's not the cool strategy that you learned because if your capacity container isn't expanded accordingly, to be able to actually deal with and sustain that, it's either not going to work or it's not going to stick.

So, it's kind of like embarking on a crash diet, and you're just using your willpower to carry you through. And that works for a few days, or maybe a few weeks, but eventually, if your entire system isn't on board, you're right back where you started. In addition to that, you’ll have lost steam in the process and be exhausted.

So, in my opinion, it's worth it to put in the time and effort to build capacity as you go so you can do it once and thoroughly, rather than willing yourself to get there and using a lot of energy and a lot of willpower and a lot of motivation. In the short-term that works, but in the long-term you’re back to where you started.

Naomi Nakamura: Imagine if you have an undefined Head, undefined Root. undefined G-center.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah. I find that very easy. I mean, not the G-center, but yeah, undefined Heart.

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly - all of those things. Do you have any client stories that you can share? What kind of transformation people have had by working on their capacity?

Nadia Gabrielle: I have a really good example from a client I just started working with, and I'm so proud of her. I'm really invested in all my clients. When I can feel them have success so quickly, and I can see them really take to this work, it's so rewarding for me as well.

So, she's been doing really great work, and it's already paying off. She's a great example, because I've been lucky to support her with both strategy and capacity.

Last year, she took Service Design School, which is my 5-week program for service-based business owners, where I teach them everything they need to know using - I mean, you and I have talked about this –

Naomi Nakamura: I'm a two-timer and I still refer to the exercises. When I have a new idea of something want to create, I pull out those exercises.

Nadia Gabrielle: That makes me so happy. That's exactly how I envisioned it, right. It's not a one-time and done 0 not at all. It's really a methodology that you learn and then you speak that language and Human-centered Design and Design Thinking principles and how to craft usable and desirable services that people actually want and are willing to pay for.

So, this client took the self-study course and then this year, we began working together on capacity which I only do one-on-one because whilst we had it all visualized, you really can't teach or do it like that.

Naomi Nakamura: You can't.

Nadia Gabrielle: It's so personal where two people can have the exact same issue that results in the same types of pains in their business. But the root and reason behind that is going to be so different for each individual.

So, she booked to work on capacity specifically, because she had already upped her strategy in SDS. It was time to even it out with the capacity.

So, with her, we have a clear focus on developing and building financial capacity. She's got some specific goals that will require her to be able to bring in and handle and sustain larger amounts of revenue.

What was extremely interesting with her, and she told me this in our first session, she said that she's been upping her business structures, and already more cash is coming in through this business, which is excellent.

However, as more money comes in, she's also spending more. She said to me, “It's wild - it feels like the more I make, the more I spend, and in the end, it kind of evens out.”

When I hear something like that in my mind, all the light bulbs, sort of turn on, because again, I've been doing this for many years, and I've seen all sorts of capacity narratives play out.

And this is when I've seen before, many times where you can really visually imagine that container that let's say a cup, which is your financial capacity, and all of a sudden you take a business class, or you take a course and you learn and you're now equipped to set up your offers in a way that brings in more revenue.

But if you've not adjusted the size of that capacity container, you're just pouring that liquid that water into the same size cup, and what's going to happen? It's just going to overflow, right? I can't hold it.

So, even if more money is coming in, her system is going “nope, Ican't hold it, I can't deal with it, I don't want to. Let's find a reason for this money to leave my account as quickly as it comes in.”

In the meantime, we've had two sessions and we found the reason her system wasn't primed to receive that, and by the way, it's never as simple as “Oh, it's just a money capacity issue,” like the root will be something completely different have nothing to do with business, nothing to do with any of that.

For her, without giving too much information, went back to family of origin and some loyalties that she had sort of subconsciously pledged to different players that kept her from reaching her goals because again, in her case, the revenue did go up, but the money flowed out just as quickly as it came in.

I hear this so often from clients who hadn't previously done capacity work, only done strategy work. So, they're like, “Okay, I just had the biggest launch I've ever had, I've made more than I've ever made in this one launch than I had previously.” And a few weeks later, the bank account is back to what it was pre-launch because that's what you've got the capacity for and that's what we have to understand when we're at the beginning of a brand new year.

Now when we map out a year and we take some time in January, February to set our intentions and to write down our tangible goals because even though our list of intentions for the year may read whatever, you're under 50k of revenue - if you've made 50k In the year prior your capacity level probably is the left that 50k.

So again, it takes both strategy and capacity.

And with this client, we've had two sessions, and after the second session, which was our big sort of capacity expansion sessions, she emailed me the other day to say that right after she's had her biggest revenue day ever since the very start of her business.

She's been in business for herself for a while. Isn't that wild? I’m excited for her. And we've got a few more sessions coming up. So, I can't wait to see with her where she will be at the end of this.

But you know, it was essentially like a capacity intensive. So, I'm really excited about it.

Naomi Nakamura: I know people will be curious if they have not yet listened to Episode 179. How does one get started working on capacity?

Nadia Gabrielle: I know each time I talk about this, it’s like, “Okay, this is me. Chances are you will have been able to pinpoint sort of your current capacity ceiling that is preventing you from truly seeing results, even though you're probably putting in a lot of work like with the kind of people that I work with.

They're doing a lot of work, it's not thinking.

So, Naomi, I came up with this idea. I knew we were ready to do a special offer for this next month, when you book capacity session with me all my sessions are an hour, but this is coming out in February, so let's say for the month of March, I'm going to offer a 90-minute session at my usual one-hour price. So, we've got like 50% more time to get into it.

And if you know how I work, you know that we get a lot done in that time.

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly, yes. I remember we got a lot done.

Nadia Gabrielle: So yes, you basically pay for 60-min and get 90 minutes. I put together a link in the show notes for this episode, and then the code “CAPACITY” at checkout. I'm excited to dive in with you because really, it's again, it's both strategy and capacity.

Naomi Nakamura: Just to give folks an idea when you talk about your client and how her you're working on financial capacity, when she really thought about it actually wasn't about money.

I can share a little bit for me. A few years ago as I was doing one of the nutrition school programs, I realized that I actually have a scarcity mindset.

Nadia Gabrielle: Mm hmm.

Naomi Nakamura: The program talked about all the different challenges that we have, kinda like archetypes, and scarcity was one of them.

I realized that it showed up in every part of my life – from how I feed myself, how I manage my money, my relationships. I've unpacked a lot of it.

I grew up in a place that was really small, isolated and very rural. So, I always had, and to some degree still do, this fear of running out of things.

I can see how that has shown up in pretty much in all aspects of my life, even though I’m now an adult.

These are kind of the things what you're referring to when we talk about capacity, right? Working through some of these things.

Nadia Gabrielle: Exactly. Coming in with your conscious adult self that now no longer needs these protective mechanisms that did serve you at some point in time, but to lovingly release that crap and go, “Okay, well, this was helpful, but some point, this is actually no longer needed because I'm at a very different stage in my life. I have tools and things available to me that will help me, even if things are a little bit difficult, I don't need these protective mechanisms so much anymore, but that takes time.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah, I have to tell myself, “Oh, I don't need to buy three packs of toilet paper, because the store is literally half a mile away around the corner.”

Nadia Gabrielle: But there's a part of you that’s like, “No, we need this.”

Naomi Nakamura: Back in the day, before the internet we got one trip a year to fly the big city, because we lived on an island, and that's when went school shopping and all of those things.

Nadia Gabrielle: And so once, so we werbetter got it in, you know….

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly - we got our McDonald's because that was what happened once a year.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, wow. Yeah. So, you had to be prepared. What does that translate into? You probably were really on it, you were preparing for that trip, you made sure that you didn't forget anything, because that was your one…

Naomi Nakamura: What we got, we really drew out and but there's also this - always wanting what we don't have. So, that's something where I'm like, “If I want it, I'm gonna get it. You know, at work there’s these incentives and I'm like - I'm sorry, your incentive has to be really big for me to really drive wherever you want. Because if I want something, I'm just gonna get it.

Nadia Gabrielle: And this, I think often, this really goes back to family as well, the patterns that we've inherited from the generations before us as well. So, it probably didn't just start with you, right?

Naomi Nakamura: Oh, absolutely.

Nadia Gabrielle: And those are difficult, but not impossible, and I always think it's worth it.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah, I think half the battle is just recognizing it qnd then one, also accepting that this might be like lifelong things you have to work on.

Nadia Gabrielle: But it's absolutely making progress.

Naomi Nakamura: Absolutely.

Nadia Gabrielle: It's kind of like Human Design, right. I always say our charts don't change these topics. This is not like, “I'm gonna have one session and I'm going to tackle my undefined Heart and then from then on, it will no longer be an issue. This is going to be a topic for me for my entire life, but I can have the awareness of it, and I can set structures and have structures in place for myself in business to make sure that it doesn't trip me up so much. And that, I kind of catch myself before I go down that shadowy undefined Heart dream. And that's helpful, but it is going to be an ongoing topic.

The most wonderful book that my friend Emily wrote it, and it's about to come out in the spring, I'm going to talk about it a bunch, because I want everyone to read it, but one thing she said that I'm sure she's okay with me sharing is that a soul when it comes on onto planet Earth, or when it prepares to incarnate, that we choose the circumstances that we're born into really, really meticulously, and that is our family, the time, down to the second.

That includes the Human Design chart we're born with.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah, we have agency.

Nadia Gabrielle: Exactly. And the astrology that we're born with. And when I read that, that really made a lot click into place for me in terms of a soul chooses their assignments, or their karmic lesson that they comes into this body with and this life with.

I think sometimes we have this tendency to want to make a laundry list. Like I said in the beginning, kind of just go, “Okay, let's make a list, and then have it off our plates”. These are lifelong topics and I just signed up for that.

Naomi Nakamura: Something just came to mind. In my full-time job, I work in a go-to-market function, which is not just marketing. But we've been having conversations about sales enablement, and we finally pointed out to people that awareness and enablement are two separate things.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, tell me more about that.

Naomi Nakamura: Say we have a new offer coming out that we're going to go out and socialize with our field, with our salespeople. But that's not enabling them, right? We're just building awareness.

So, they're aware of it. They know it's coming, but enablement is when you actually put forth the work of telling them how to do this. How is this is going to make their jobs better? How is this going to help them meet their quota. These are two different things. They're two different activities. And we have to approach them differently because the intent is different.

Nadia Gabrielle: So, one is more like raising awareness, like this thing that's coming. And the other is like education and support.

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly. And I think this is exactly what we're talking about is like, it's one thing to be aware that these are things that you have, and then you do the enablement, you do the work, you do the integration, to build your capacity.

Nadia Gabrielle: Absolutely. And to hold it. And I mean, that by itself, I mean, I talk to clients who I've been working with for one year or two years, and we look back and we're like, remember Day One? They're thriving in a way that we couldn't have even foreseen at the time. I just always think, you've done this, you have built this capacity for yourself, and now you get to enjoy it. So, go and enjoy that because the capacity that you've built is yours to enjoy, you're not going to just live in your house one day to the next. You've built this and you've put in the work and you get to just enjoy the fruits of that labor or a long time to come.

Naomi Nakamura: It expands beyond your business.

Nadia Gabrielle: It really does.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah, your system doesn't differentiate what is only for business.

Nadia Gabrielle: No, not at all. I mean, obviously, this is work I've done in my business that really comes in handy in my personal life and communication and so on.

Naomi Nakamura: Okay, let's talk about strategy.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yay. My other favorite! Well, so yeah, as we said, the pillars of strategy and capacity.

We've covered capacity, and of course, in order to get our businesses to the next level, whether that's terms of revenue growth, for quality of clients, if you're a service provider, you also want to have a solid strategy.

It's not either/or,capacity is a must. Strategy is also a must. I would never say it's one or the other.

So, my next focus on the strategy side of my business is to support my students who are looking to uplevel their businesses with an offer that teaches them to intelligently design, craft, and sell scalable product offers.

I'm so excited, it's going to be my most in-depth offer yet. I just know that my students will benefit from it for years and decades to come,

Naomi Nakamura: How is this different?

Nadia Gabrielle: Great question, we've talked about this as well, right? We just can't do surface level, it's just not possible. It's just not going to happen. It's going to be incredibly detailed.

So, on the strategy side of my business, I've got Service Design School - we usually just call it SDS for short. It’s my five-week program that I've talked about. It's all about teaching service-based business owners to craft usable and desirable services using Design Thinking, using Human-centered Design.

This is part of my skill set. It's what I studied at uni and what I've been helping business owners with.

SDS has been around for a few years now. So many business owners have moved through the curriculum and seen great results. And as you said, you've done SDS as well.

Now this new offer is the next step. Whereas SDS is about services, this new course, is about products.

It's about teaching my students to craft scalable digital products that will allow them to stop trading time for money, and to have much more time and freedom in their businesses.

So, you're able to spend more time with your family, or it could free you up to start developing a new branch of your business that you've had in mind for a while, but the time was never there.

There's quite a few differences between service design and product design. Services, as you know, inherently are inseparable from the person providing them, meaning they're always present during the service.

Whereas those products, it's very different, right, you’ll be doing a lot of work in the back end to design a product offer and put it together. And because you're not there in real time, as your product is being consumed, the backend process of creating the offer is incredibly important to do because when you don't, that's when you have launches that you hear crickets or two people sign up and purchase.

Then you feel defeated and there's no breaking even because there's a lot of time and energy that went into making the product or making the course or the class or whatever it was.

There is a lot of time and energy that go into well-designed, intelligently designed digital products. And what's also going to be different and new is that this course has a deeper focus on selling the product offer because of course when it comes to digital products, the magic is in the quantity.

So, in order for that to be a really profitable branch of business, in order for that to work for you while you're not necessarily working or you're doing whatever you want, maybe you're still working but you're working on something else, you of course want people to find your offer and purchase it. So we've got a whole module on selling - the psychology of selling, and the ins and outs of that.

And again, if you've been in the galaxy of my business, you know that everything I do is very in depth and thought through. It's almost like - it's not like a four-year university education that is quite general and can sometimes be a little bit dry - I did that, I sat through these lectures, right? I learned all that and I got to learn, I'm super grateful. I’m not saying it was all dry, I got to learn from some of the world's really top service, 2d and 3d product designers.

What I do and what I love to do, is to apply that to your field so that you can learn it in a way that is already tailored to you and your business. It’s such a gross way of saying, and I need to think of another way, but it's like it's already pre-digested.

Naomi Nakamura: Well, and also think about it as Projectors, and I know a large part of your audience are Projectors as is mine because we're both Projectors.

Yeah, selling is really hard for us, because the way that the world teaches is Sacral energy, or Manifestor energy to to initiate or to respond, but to have to wait for an invitation it's selling is something that's it's disjointed there, because it's not something that the world teaches us to do.

Nadia Gabrielle: Both when it comes to both services and products. Selling actually starts with the setup of either the service sequence or the crafting of the product, I think that's where it starts. It's not just the thing you kind of slap on at the end.

I think as people looking for this, they're also very smart and savvy as well. So, you don't have a solid offering, people are going to see through it, and they can read the energy behind.

It's just going to be much easier. I've seen this with one client I'm thinking of in particular, we've talked a lot about the offer as its own entity, and also kind of taking away that pressure that you as the creator have.

It's almost like thinking of your offer as a child - you have brought it into the world. But at some point, it's growing into its own person or again, its own entity, and you don't want to do the software disservice by kind of selling it in a way that doesn't feel right or by getting really shy and not talking about it when it comes up because you're feeling insecure about it, right? That's the capacity thing.

So, there's a lot there. And I've been cooking this up. I've been dreaming this up for years now, in fact, since the inception of Service Design School. I've had people message me saying, “I really want to learn from you, but I don't work with people. I don't want to work with people one-on-one. I sell courses, I teach online, I sell e-books,” and I could see the need.

And then of course working with my clients and students closely, also with my Service Design Students over the last few years, the natural progression of many service-based business owners after a while right getting to the point where they're ready to cater to more people at once than they could in a one-on-ones, right?

Naomi Nakamura: This is like really coming full circle with Service Design School, right?

Nadia Gabrielle: Yes, whatever digital product you create can be a funnel.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah.

Nadia Gabrielle: Because to me one-on-one work is top level tier, right? It has to be a set time that two people are available.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah.

Nadia Gabrielle: Me as a Projector in particular - that's a different kind of energy to it because your auric focus.

I always say like your auric focus as a Projector is your premium. There is nothing like having your eyes on someone else on whatever it is whatever you help people with, you know, nutrition coaching, or business coaching or whatever, it's like that is the gold standard.

But I think it actually goes in both directions. It can be a funnel, so the product can be the funnel into your services, but also your services are going to inform.

Naomi Nakamura: Exactly.

Nadia Gabrielle: Because what you learn through working with people is going to be the product you create. So, I have seen it truthfully for a long time. But I just didn't get around to doing it because I have no motors defined and it takes me a long time to make things because I want that I do the absolute.

Naomi Nakamura: So, my question to you is as an undefined Head, this is a detail because we talked about before we start recording. I’m creating, and I don't even want to call it a course because I don't like that word, a program. It's a workshop. I go back and forth about is this an awareness program? Or is this an enablement? Is this a hybrid between the two.

But because I'm a very visual learner, I have slides. I was at over 200 slides. And I'm like, this is supposed to be a really simple thing. I need to pull this back, but my undefined Head is like, “Ih, I need this, and I need this.

Nadia Gabrielle: Absolutely. It's a process for me as well. I gather everything, put everything, you know that I love to work with post it’s…

Naomi Nakamura: I was gonna say I'm curious about your process.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yes, so all the post-its. Just put it all down. Does all of these things need to be in it? All of this? This is all I know., This is what I would have to double check. This I have to read up on. Then I start structuring it. That's the neat thing with post-its - an order will start emerging as you structure it, as you go. “Oh, this doesn't make sense to put here. Actually, people need to know this first,” and we can build on it and so on and so on and so on.

Then you look at it and then you kind of start crafting it and then I think you need to make sure that we're not just including things for the sake of including them. What do people actually nee?

So, this is going to be for me as well. The iteration and reiteration process that's going to take weeks, months, and probably years, right?

Same with Service Design School - it wasn't the first iteration of Service Design School and the one the final self-study course that we have up now are galaxies, galaxies away, because as we've learned, you listen to feedback. People are like, “Oh, I needed more time here. Actually, this was an in depth enough” and you go, and you reiterates and redesign.

So, same with the product offering. And, again, if the question is, do people need this, or do I just want to add it so, it's really, complete. It's a balancing act, because I do want to give people a complete thing, when it comes to product, because you're gonna attract different people.

So, I do err on the side of, “I want to provide something really robust, because also people will have, it's going to be same as service design, people will have access to it for an entire year.” That's, you know, three a year, your business can really up-level a lot.

My idea, intention, and wish is always that people come back to this material and work with it as their offers evolve.

So, I want things to be there, not necessarily for them to incorporate and apply everything from the very beginning, but there's going to be things that you're like, “oh, okay, I'll get back to this when I'm at this stage,” and then I want it to be there for you.

So, it is going to be a lot, but I also try to teach it in a way that’s digestible and accessible, and I put my own spin on it.

Naomi Nakamura: Well, I know you're an analogue person. But if you're listening, and you're not for the post-it exercises, there's mind-mapping apps that are fantastic.

Nadia Gabrielle: Really, do you use those?

Naomi Nakamura: I do, because I found one just in the Apple Store. You can turn the actual map into post-its and you can add notes.

Nadia Gabrielle: What do you mean?

Naomi Nakamura: You can turn the map into post-it – a mind map. You have the different notes, so you can actually flip it, like it looks like a note and you can add notes.

Nadia Gabrielle: How? Naomi Nakamura: So, if you had a big sheet of paper, and then you have time, you can move things around, because it's the mind-mapping tool, but you can put notes behind the node.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, that's really cool, especially for people who don't want to…

Naomi Nakamura: I don't have a wall in my house that I can post post-its. I would love to and I actually have stacks of post-its, but I literally don't have like a wall or space to be able to do it.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah, I mean, I will forever be. This is how I studied. This is what my teachers taught me, I need the post-its in my hand. People know, “Oh, she took out the post-its, she's serious.

Naomi Nakamura: It's so exciting. I want to take this program for myself.

Oh, and so what is bringing it all together mean?

Nadia Gabrielle: I'm just excited, because I can see that, again, my offers usually respond to some sort of need. And I can see that my clients, my students are at the point where they're ready to stop being limited by the time-equals-money equation kind of thing.

So, the need has been there. I think specifically the need for a really sound and solid education that's not magical thinking, that's not manifesting,

I've been hearing that call and I'm really excited to be in a position now where I have the time to create this and to accompany it live, which is also important.

Naomi Nakamura: I was just gonna as if it’s to be live.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah. I'm going to be with you live as you move through the curriculum, which is no longer the case in Service Design.

Naomi Nakamura: I was gonna say your first few iterations of SDS was live, which I think is always the best way if you're taking a program.

Nadia Gabrielle: And then eventually, following your own my own tea, it becomes a self-guided tool.

Naomi Nakamura: So, if you want the guidance jump on it.

Nadia Gabrielle: Exactly, because you do it year after year after year, and you meet with people every week and you see them advance and you meet with some people one-on-one as well. You hear their questions and then you can reiterate and you can redesign, you can incorporate these things.

At some point it becomes so robust that your one-on-one input is no longer needed.

But I want you also expand your network which I think as business owners is always a great thing.

Naomi Nakamura: I mean the episode before this one is a fellow Service Design classmate.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, cool. I love them. That makes me so happy. I always love when people like find each other in the broader galaxy. And then you know, I hear later I get a picture of like, “Oh, we met up and it’s so cool.

Naomi Nakamura: I know I have past podcast guests that were like, “I ran a retreat and this person came because they found me through your podcast!” I actually have former guests say, this happened twice, “a high school friend Googled me and found me on your show and we got back together and we were in touch again.”

Nadia Gabrielle: That's so cool. Oh my god, I love that. I will say I also get so many DM’s and emails from people who got were introduced to my work through our podcasts or you know, have my intake form when someone works with me one-on-one, I have this question of how did you find me? And quite often, it's, “I heard you on Naomi's podcast; I heard one episode and I finished them all.”

Naomi Nakamura: Oh that makes me so happy.

Nadia Gabrielle: So yeah, bringing it together.

What I will say is the most success I see in clients is when their strategy and capacity are aligned. So, bringing it together to me means that in the case of this example, where we do product design on a strategy level, and when I say product design, of course, there's lots of products, you know, there's industrial products, there's all sorts, but we're specifically talking about digital - we do that on the strategy level. And we do financial capacity and a capacity level, which again, I only do one-on-one - it means that on the strategy level, we focus on creating offers that allow you to get paid whether you work or not.

And at the same time, ideally, on the capacity level, we expand the financial capacity to hold and sustain that greater revenue, which is what the example of my clients I'm working with right now.

So that's sort of where it comes together. You never want one of the two pillars to be so far away from the other where it's like, “Oh, I've got this amazing strategy, but like, I've never even looked at it.” I mean, at some point, you will have to look at it, because you're not going to become painful enough that you will look at it, but we wouldn't let it get to that point.

Naomi Nakamura: I like to think of it as deferred revenue, right? Because we do all the backend work upfront and then when you release it, then, you get paid for it. So, I like to think of it as deferred revenue.

Nadia Gabrielle: And it is a lot of work in the back end. And that's all I'm working on. I'm getting paid, but I'm not working. But oh, no, you did work you really did. And again, I will say when products, again, much, much more important even than for services, I mean, but services, you also want to be thorough, but for products to do a lot of in depth crafting and designing. Because again, you're not going to be there in the moment; you're not going to be there with your undefined identity to kind of pick up on if the mood sort of goes awry, or someone's not getting what they're wanting. You can't just course-correct in the moment. We can't just be like, “Oh, actually, I'm sort of sensing that the group needs this.”

The product needs to stand for itself, which means that you need to be incredibly clear on what you're providing. You need to be clear on who you're providing it to, how you're structuring it, how you're selling it in a way that is also respectful to yourself and to your customers.

I mean, I am so lit up by this.

Naomi Nakamura: I can tell I can feel it emanating from you.

Nadia Gabrielle: As I said last year, I really took quite a bit of time off. I did still work with clients, and I did teach a bit but I didn't really have one big offer that I put together.

Now this is my time sort of back in my personal happy space, which is at my desk with my post-its, putting something together and designing something where there was nothing before and seeing it come together. And I'm really excited. And everyone I've told so far is like, “Oh my god, this is what I've been waiting for. I can't wait to sign up.”

Naomi Nakamura: I'm gonna ask you a question that I hate people asking me. So, you know, we talked about when you work for yourself there's no like set deadline? So, when is the deadline? When can people expect this because, I've been working on my program for nine months since my session with you. I've teased it out and I finally just said, “I can't promise when this is going to come out.”

Nadia Gabrielle: I mean, I shouldn't make any promises because I'm an undefined Heart. I need to stop doing that. But I can tell you, my personal deadline for myself, that may still need to be adjusted because as you know, it's always more work than you think it is. But I'm thinking this is going to be a Spring 2023 baby.

Naomi Nakamura: I was gonna say, saying a season is great, because you got like three months in there.

Nadia Gabrielle: Three months. I mean, we're clearly talking end of Spring, we're not talking March, probably not. Maybe we are, I'm not sure. What the cool thing is, this is going to be a longer program.

So, you know, I get to adjust as we go, because again, I'm also really excited to work with a group live again.

I mean, last year, Service Design was wonderful, and I really missed that. I missed that weekly anchor of meeting up, and also people meeting their cohorts. There are people who are still in touch from Service Design 2022, which was my last live cohort. They're still meeting up and supporting each other. People have had each other on their podcasts and have met up in real life and they're helping each other with their businesses and collaborating and WhatsApp groups.

Naomi Nakamura: Because your students are global. So just want to say you are in Switzerland, I’m in California, but the way you structure your live programs, I mean, it's a little bit of a stretch, because we're like all in different time zones, but and you have the southern half of the Southern Hemisphere join.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah, there's a really broad spectrum in terms of geographical locations, but also just, you know, where are you at with your business.

We've had quite a few people in Service Design who just started and we've had some more seasoned business owners. It's just really nice, I think for the group to get to learn from each other. I did have that.

Naomi Nakamura: I personally enjoy the international really, because if you think about it, if you have an online business, you have the potential to have clients from wherever they are in this world.

And another reason I love following you on Instagram, besides all your content is that you live in another part of the world. And I just like to see what life is like.

Nadia Gabrielle: Oh, I'm the same way. I love that. Like when I go on holiday somewhere as well, my friends always tease me my favorite thing is to just go to the supermarket and just like, why don't people get…I'll just like peek at my basket.

Naomi Nakamura: My favorite thing to do when I go to LA is to go through the grocery store. My friend that I go with, that's the first thing we do - we're gonna go to Erewhon and literally walk up and down the aisles. People watch it, people want to see what's on the shelves there. What are people getting?

Nadia Gabrielle: Right? I mean, I would never do this at home because for me out of my mind, when I'm in London, I'm like, I'll go, whatever, six o'clock, seven o'clock after work. I mean, I'm not specifically timing it that way. I will already be sort of that goes for whatever it is. And then I decided I was so you're getting not like if wonder who you're making non for. Waiting at home. Where are you going? Are you What are you doing tonight? Like, I mean, don't ask these things just wander. But it's so fun. And I've done this all over the world. And again, all my childhood friends are kind of like, oh my god are we going to have to like go to the frozen section of the supermarket again, and just like a look at the food.

Naomi Nakamura: One of my favorite things when I was in New York City was going to Central Park during the spring and summer after the work day and just to see people are coming out to play sports, just to hang out in the park because the sun's still out and it's just people going about their lives.

Nadia Gabrielle: Exactly. It's my favorite thing.

Naomi Nakamura: I'm not the type to go on a holiday and pack in every single tourist thing. Like I very quickly learned that if someone likes that we are not compatible travel buddies.

Nadia Gabrielle: It's fun, right? You're like, oh, wow, people actually live here, like, what do they do? What do they do after work? I mean, the same way. And I liked that as well. I mean, that was one of my wishes. And one of my intentions with my own business that I really wanted to be able to have an international clientele and just feel

Naomi Nakamura: I mean, I think when you have an online business, you have to take those things into consideration.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yeah, and it's fun, right? Because I mean, we talked about this in SDS when we talk about segmentation you don't need to geographically segment. You can if it makes sense for you but you don't have to. So for me that is one where one piece of segmentation where I have my filter all the way wide. I will talk to someone from California in the morning and then I'll talk to someone from Australia and then I'll talk to someone in Berlin - that's my day and that I couldn't be happier about that because I've always wanted that.

Naomi Nakamura: Okay, I feel like I've taken up so much of your time but how can people connect with you?

Nadia Gabrielle: Same as always @_NadiaGabrielle on Instagram, at @ProjectorsInvited if you're a Projector, hop on over www.nadiagabrielle.com and www.projectorsinvited.com. And that's it.

Naomi Nakamura: And I'll have links to your special offer as well as to the other episodes that you were on. So, the show notes for this episode will be www.livefablife.com/250 for Episode 250.

Nadia Gabrielle: Yay, 250. That's a good one. I was really happy when I saw that. Yes, waitlist. No, I love me a waitlist. Wonderful. It'll be in the notes. I just love to talk to the people who like raise their hand and say, Yeah, I'm interested, like, Tell me more because I enjoy talking to a group like that more than just sort of talking into the ether. So yeah, if you're interested, do sign up for the waitlist. We'll be the first to know when I get my act together and open.

Naomi Nakamura: Basically, well, I’ll be on the waitlist. I always love talking to you. I've been looking forward to our conversation for me now. And you always have an open door, so hopefully you'll come back for some additional episodes sometime soon.

Nadia Gabrielle: I absolutely will. And if anyone's curious about anything in particular, I think I speak for both of us, I always love to hear because we're not just showing up. I mean, I am showing up just to chat to Naomi, the recording going in the background, but alsoI think we're showing up in order for this to be helpful and useful and valuable. So, I always love to hear what people are interested in.

Naomi Nakamura: Yeah, if you have any topics you'd like to suggest, please send them over and we'll make it happen.

Nadia Gabrielle: Thanks so much, Naomi.